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The future of stuzzy

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The_Dremlock87 Supporter
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It would seem that with each reset...less players make it back. I am wondering if it may be time or possible to make a continual map rather than one that resets when updates occur. I am understanding of the fact that a lot of plugins are version relative and older versions can be corrupted, but with the drastic loss of players, I would be willing to be rid of some or all of the plugins in order to have a continual map that would allow for new blocks/items/mechanics that come with updates to mc. I have been on servers that have this and they seem to be able to update the map without issue. I understand that grief protection is one of the biggest issues with this thread, but what if the server was white listed or raum was magical and able to write his own protection plugin that would not glitch with updates... I understand that this does not help with the addition of new members, but basic survival players are few and far between anyway. If they really want to play- they can write on the forums or msg the owner...

Another Idea which goes against the original idea haha .. add more custom stuff to the stuzz vote shop (stuzz is a more or less basic mc server.. lets find more ways to set us apart! Every post your ideas! I can see things like custom mining tools- custom weapons-custom armor-spawners-custom items-wither skulls/nether stars/beacons-bottled xp- fly time (time could be based on points/money/fuel in inventory-world edit time(uses your money per block type+ surcharge for world edit use)-custom potions-Custom/normal enchant books-rare blocks- Ranks(yes, paid ranks via voting.. lets say a month of voting for first rank, 2 for second and so on) and there are many more things that could be added to the vote shop that would push more to vote, and entice those that have yet to try stuzzy. I count myself within the group that has not done their part with voting. Voting is one part of the reason stuzzy has lost playerbase lately... maybe new perks to voting can be a major reason for its rebirth. Please help! voting takes less than 5 minutes and gives you great perks!


1.12 has custom crafting.. not sure of the extent you can go with it.. but maybe it is the answer to not having to reset post 1.12... I am not a programmer .. others may know more about this subject... please post your thoughts!
Posted Sep 24, 17 · OP
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So then... (This will be a long one...)

1) Continual map vs resetting map:
We've already voted in polls what to do with the map when updates happen. For some versions we have kept the same map for two updates straight, for others we've reset for obvious reasons, or because the next update came after a long time.
For instance, the move from 1.6 to 1.7 had to happen because the world generation algorithm changed and a bunch of things were added. 1.8 brought water temples (yech!) and lots of other stuff, and came almost a year after 1.7... 1.9 came a year and a half after 1.8 and Slimefun was added to the server, and 1.10 kept the same world as 1.9 since the updates were only 3 or 4 months apart and it brought mostly Nether stuff - and the Nether resets each month... With 1.11 came Woodland Mansions with their mobs, and llamas, and Slimefun was removed from the server. Now, for 1.12 it was the discord chat that decided (and I think it's about time that we all eventually jumped in it). In my opinion, a map for 1.12 wasn't really needed, even if the update came 6 months after 1.11, as the only thing that got added generation-wise was parrots. Everything else is craftable. Alas, it was decided among the more active players. The 1.11 map is of course still around, but now people are going to be split between the 1.11 and 1.12 worlds...
Now, of course we also have the Farm World, and since it's the world where we are expected to get our resources from, we could have this one be the resetting one (as is already the case) and leave the Main World to be non-resetting. However, some of us like to start over every now and then, and sometimes we want to find a spot that has new features. Personally, I'm kinda split on resetting vs continual, and up until now I've agreed with how things have gone, as you can mostly tell from the previous paragraph.

2) Plugins and Updates:
The map itself doesn't really depend on the plugins (I think?), so these should pose no problem (I think?)... But what I don't know is, if it is even possible to keep one continual map that updates its blocks with each version. Doesn't that glitch out terrain generation or something? I'm aware that a map that is played in a new version, will generate its new chunks with the updated block. Thing is, if the world generation algorithm changes again, those new chunks could make for some out of place terrain, and a reset would be called for again.

3) Grief Protection: Ask Raum if he's willing to put in even more time than he already has for the server, to create his own protection plugin (let alone more Stuzzcraft-specific plugins). Even if he did, code changes from version to version, so incompatibilities are always guaranteed. That's the hard life of the coder. Not that I am one, but ask any coder and he'll tell you that.
And the thing is, most people don't even use grief protection. How many times have I stumbled upon a marvellous build, only to find it unclaimed? Prime target for griefers. If people are unwilling to whip out the golden shovel and claim their space (and don't tell me you don't have thousands of claim blocks available!), then maybe get rid of the plugin and let them suffer the consequences... BUT that could lead to frustration among those that have used the plugin, because they want that extra layer of protection. Speaking for myself, people messing with the farmland, livestock, builds and decors that I've put time into, no matter how simplistic - and especially if complex! - can be quite disheartening. Even more so if there is no moderator there to roll everything back. Then again we have the ticket system, so that's something.

4) Whitelisting:
To be honest, I don't know if whitelisting attracts or detracts players looking for a more peaceful Minecraft experience. And I think the reason we have no whitelist is because we like to consider this server an open community (as funny as it sounds nowadays with the lack of players).
Suppose we do put in a whitelist, and we have people asking to join in the forums. Who would be around to handle those requests, and what if the number of requests suddenly exploded? And then, who can guarantee that those people will stick around and not leave within the first week?

5) Voting and Perks:
I expressed my sentiments on voting to you ingame yesterday, and I've expressed them on the thread that Raum did when donations hit an all-time low back in late 2015. Specifically I said there: "Voting? I could try to do it every day, but I think it gets repetitive fairly quickly, even if for the server's good... and there are some repetitive things even I find to be too repetitive :p". (And yeah, since then I still have no bank account or stable job :p)
As far as new perks... 300 Stuzzbucks and a random amount of diamonds are already good. We already get custom decoration blocks from completing either of the parkours. Custom enchants could make one overpowered compared to other players, unless it's something fun like the Grandpa's Walking Stick that I still have from Slimefun (Stick with Knockback V ftw!)... Hey, maybe it could be enchants that add a fun factor to the playing experience! There, new idea! Although, we'd either need a plugin for custom enchants, or a couple of people to devote time to learning the ins and outs of commands, NBT tags etc, and then help Raum set those up, and then a randomizing factor (which most likely would require a plugin)...
Also, donator ranks via voting is too farfetched of an idea, since that would mean much less motivation to donate (for those able to, at least), and Raum & Co probably already struggle to keep the server running against all odds.

6) Miscellanea
One thing I don't know of, is the state of Shops. Do players buy anything from them at all? Is there even any stock in the Shops? Because if not, we could do away with them and have one shop for all needs, with prices that would scale based on usefulness/rarity of block/item, strength and durability of item, amount of enchantments on item, power of enchanting book etc etc... That would perhaps give an incentive to go hunting for resources more in the Farm World, kinda like you would work IRL to make yourself money to buy stuff that you want or need. Of course keep player transactions in the form of giving another player something and have them /pay whatever amount.

These are my two cents. If I ever come up with anything else, I'll write it down.
Posted Sep 25, 17 · Last edited Sep 25, 17
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Strychnos LegendSupporter
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1) Continual map vs resetting map:
The main -- and really the only -- problem I see with continued maps is the fact that if the update adds new terrain you'd have to generate more land to see them. This would likely make the world borders be forced to expand unless there was very little exploration on the original map. I think the best approach here is to do the 1.11-1.12 thing. Keep both running for a few weeks to give people time to transfer if they want to. While you do lose your builds, there's nothing stopping you from using Schematica to copy them over, unless Raum tells you not to.
2) Plugins and Updates:
As far as I know everything here holds up. However, even if you keep the same map and just update it you'd still need to update the plugins to match the version or you'll get some real funky stuff goin' on.
3) Grief Protection:
The problem with the whole "thousands of blocks available!" doesn't always hold true. I've had to claim stuff for my three closest friends on more than one occasion because they just don't play consistently enough to claim everything they make. Some people build something, barely claim it, then build something else and hope it doesn't get ripped. Unfortunately claim blocks aren't always easy to come by for new players. I've never had a problem with it and I end up selling thousands at a time, but I also have over 150 days of ontime ((when including before the ontime reset bug in the 1.8 reset)).
4) Whitelisting:
I personally think whitelist is a bad idea for this server. I just don't like the idea that people might see that it's whitelisted and move on, especially younger players who may not know how forums work. The only way I can see whitelist working is if it's temporary during certain times, like maintenance or world resetting. A few minutes to a few hours at most.
5) Voting and Perks:
Stuzzcraft is supposed to feel Vanilla and I'm all for adding more voting rewards, but the custom enchants and tools seem like a bit much. And world edit? Correct me if I'm wrong but was voting for world edit seriously suggested? Even if you have to pay to use it, it's a horrible idea.
6) Miscellanea
Nobody uses or stocks shops anymore. Dakduivel is the only shop that ever has anything, and only like two of his shops aren't empty. It's ridiculous but people just forget about shop world when the map is this old I guess.
- too lazy -
Posted Sep 27, 17 · Last edited Sep 27, 17
Vilz Mod
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(gonna borrow ltl's quotation method cause that's some effective organizing)
1) Continual map vs resetting map:
Personally, i'd prefer to have a continual map and just have the farm world be the newest ver. Now, in the past, it was slightly an issue to not have one since we had so many people coming on, building random things, then leaving. It prevented the server from being too cluttered and stripped of valuables. But with the farm world (and decrease in traffic), i feel like it'd be better to have just one world and, if you want a new build, could either addon to existing or find a new loc in the main world.
Also hasnt been a generation update for a while and they've got a focus on xbox it feels like so might be a while, if any, update is coming.

Schematica mod tho, omg i love it and use it all the time. Seriously recommend it along with the world downloader mod for saving my builds and random builds I find and love.
2) Plugins and Updates:
Well, ye we need most of the plugins to function, there are very few we have that we could actually scrap as most are either integral to how the server runs and functions. A good few of them are raum's personal plugins, not sure if he has to update them between updates tho i'd imagine so, but they too are kinda necessary.
But, for some reason I don't understand (probably have to ask raum for specifics) the plugins have to be modified/rewritten between every version so there isnt an avoidance to it.

3) Grief Protection:
Imo, this is still balanced. Granted this is basing it off how I play, but i generally make a small "hole in the wall" base while i amass resources, scout a place, and plan on what to build. By the time i've done all this, I've gotten a (typically) sufficient amount of claimblocks to get the bulk of my build.
Also don't imagine many people have their builds ran across (unless like drem and Kopnac they build by spawn) and if you rocket out, it'd be out of reach of most players.
4) Whitelisting:
Kinda the same opinion as Ltl here; I feel that whitelisting would ruin the open feel of the server. Feel like the main issue is that there arent enough new players around; with the "newness" of mc kind of fading, the large amount of players left have either found servers they already like and stick to or arent interested in a "vanilla" server.
5) Voting and Perks:
Kinda like above, to make the voting lucrative we need more players to vote, but, without new players that actually stay and vote for us, we won't ever have enough people to sway the voting in our favour. So, I encourage you to keep voting and get anyone who joins to as well, but, i dont see a point to giving rewards for voting when it won't help our situation much.
6) Miscellanea
As far as the shops go, I feel they're a bust. We've never had much of a thriving economy on here (with only a few people commanding the market). Yes, a lot of the blame was that people didnt stock often enough and, the people that did, just dominated. "I" still think the mall could have worked, but was just implemented too late in the game to be effective. I think an admin shop might be fine at this point, but would only have building blocks and some ingot materials, tho I'd be strictly against (as I imagine raum would too) illegitimate items such as spawners, eggs, etc. Probably also wouldnt want enchanted books, armours, elytra's, or things that are of a "hard to acquire" nature added. Feel those would still need to be indiviually sought out or traded to acquire.

~Things that could be added~

Not sure how much work raum would want to add; however, i would love to add some more features of modded to here. In a sense it'd be similar to when we had slimefun but there might be only a handful of items or mechanics we add though it would depend on the physical limitations of what could be added.
Wand of equal trade-golden lasso (only two that came to mind at the time)

Depending on server strain/resource allotment, I would love to see us add some more worlds of varying styles. Similar to adventure maps and the like (that we'd likely shamelessly "borrow") and add some to play on. A while back, vechs made a server for his hardcore maps. something like that perhaps or a giant dungeon server?

Server I saw had a pet plugin that let you basically capture a mob (whittling down its hp and then using a lasso to kill it) which turned it into a companion that you could give a class allowing you to fight with it/ride it/use as a beast of burden, might be neat tho just having them as bob's or mounts would be nice.

Maybe expand the parkour options with more options (which would likely also be shamelessly "borrowed") and (granted this would be more work on raum's part) but change the parkour rewards to monetary point system that would allow you to buy things from the /shop (similar to the voting points) could even just have them be the same points, just weight voting to give more and increase the current prices, then add the deco heads as buying options (or item that when clicked gives a random head) and the wither skulls
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Posted Oct 8, 17 · Last edited Oct 8, 17
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To clarify, expand on a couple of things (not responding to everything, as Vil pretty much covered it all, and rewriting it would take more effort than I have this early in the morning)
1) Continual map vs resetting map:
New maps don't happen solely for the purpose of getting new biomes or blocks. Every version mod changes how the worlds are created and saved. It changes how seeds are read, how procedural generation happens, how biome seams occur, etc. For those of you who remember the 1.6 to 1.7 update (I think? Might be 1.7 to 1.8) where we didn't do a new map, we had high mountains running into ocean. Ocean dropping off into ravines. Towns stuck in the middle of mountain sides, etc. The less exploration done per version the more often these things will happen.
3) Grief Protection:
Anyone who 'actually plays' protects their stuff. Most of the new players who do not usually just don't understand, and generally after being griefed correct their methods. We'll never go to a "protect it or lose it" style of playing in the main world. If there was only one grief prevention plugin in the entire world that EVERY server had, then that'd be a little different, but there's like 50000 of them and each server is different, so new players have to actually learn about ours.

Re Shops:
Vil pretty much covered everything - the reason we've never done an Admin shop is because that would completely defeat the purpose of having player shops. The 'death' of the shop world came when Stuzz decided to limit the amount of things people could sell. The people Vil mentioned who monopolized everything just said Fuckit, and never made a new shop, cause if they can't be SUPER rich, then why bother being 'sorta' rich, etc. Even after we lowered the price again, the damage had 'already been done', so to speak, and nobody cared about Shops anymore; then there's the fact that we have so few players that all the ones that DO actively play already have what they need/want.

Re: Plugins needing to be rewritten (Some technical info, skip if you dgaf)
Long story short, version patches tend to change things, as I briefly mentioned above with generation. Some things are taken out, some things are moved, etc. Minecraft itself is obfuscated code - this means that it's (sorta) encrypted and jumbled up so that people can't just steal the code. So when we use things that directly access Minecraft's code, and not Spigot or Bukkit's code, we have to point to encrypted functions - the function, for example, to adjust the egg stack size is called "c288()" in 1.12 - In 1.13, that will change to something else, due to the obfuscation, and so any reference in any plugin that uses these will be completely broken until people figure out what the NEW reflection functions are. Some plugins we just update when they come up and we don't have to wait for them. We could do without mcMMO for a week, or the plugin that makes the NPCs run around, but others are required - WorldGuard - the one that protects spawn and such, or Multiverse, which handles the multiple worlds - these are 100% required for our server, and without them, we wouldn't have anything to work with.


The bottom line is that everything comes down to our player base. Without players, there's not much reason add new things that'll never/rarely be used (such as the mob totems, or storage drawers). Unfortunately it's a 'Catch 22' situation: without new things, no old players will start playing again to vote so no new players will come visit; and so we're stuck with trying to decide how much effort to put in before it's not worth putting in. Unfortunately with these super servers like Hypixel and Mineplex and stuff that have paid developers and thousands of players, Stuzzcraft has very little to offer.
Posted Oct 14, 17
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wrote:
these super servers like Mineplex.

You're kidding, right? Mineplex died because it was the exact opposite of SC. Sorry if I'm getting into "advertisement" territory here, but I care about this server. Instead of listening to the community like you guys do, they added new games that were broken, buggy, and never got fixed. The community got tired and left. I'd say make a poll thread about what could be added to the server. Tag the discord, make an announcement, have it as a MOTD in-game. Nothing big that would change the dynamic, but small things like a new QOL plugin, quick-paced minigame, or even a map reset.

Unfortunately, as you said, it's sort of an endless loop. No new things = no new players. No new players = new things don't get used. Rinse, repeat. I don't play this game as often as I used to (clearly by my playtime) but this server has always been like an escape from reality. I'll do anything with the time I have to keep it alive. I say take a risk. Not a big one. But take one. Advertise it like I said. Do something "fresh". I have some ideas but I don't know how well they'd be implemented.

I'm getting into ranting now, time for bed.


tl;dr: Take a chance on something small. If it works, increase the stakes. Just don't ignore the community ((I'm not saying do everything we tell you, but don't pretend we're not here; you do a good job with this already ;b)).
- too lazy -
Posted Nov 6, 17
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